Talk:Bentvueghels

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Anonymous drawing members

Some of people mentioned in the sentence "The earliest-known group picture is commemorated in an anonymous drawing in the Rotterdam (Museum Boijmans Van Beuningen), which was made about 1620, and includes Cornelis van Poelenburch, Peter van Bloemen, Bartholomeus Breenbergh, Dirck van Baburen, Paulus Bor, Cornelis Schut and Simon Ardé." were added after the fact, such as in this edit. However, I don't have access to the "Grove" source listed to see which version is correct. Can anyone look this up in the source? — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 06:20, 29 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I believe the relevant passage from the source is:

“

Hoogewerff (1923 and 1952) tried to establish 1623 as the year of the Schildersbent’s founding, basing his argument on the fact that a drawing in a series representing the group’s original members (Rotterdam, Mus. Boymans–van Beuningen) includes the portrait of Franciscus Veroli (or Viruly), who died on 14 March 1623. However, the Bent may have been formed as early as 1620 (Bodart, 1970), since Wybrand de Geest, who returned to the Netherlands before 1621, possessed a nickname similar to those always bestowed on new members at Bent induction ceremonies. Among the group’s originators identified in the Rotterdam drawings are the Dutchmen Cornelis van Poelenburch, Bartholomeus Breenbergh, Dirck van Baburen and Paulus Bor, as well as the Flemings Cornelis Schut and Simon Ardé (d 1638). The Bent later welcomed some non-Netherlandish artists such as Valentin de Boulogne, Joachim von Sandrart and Daniel Seiter (c. 1649–1705), but the preponderance of the membership was always Dutch and Flemish. Jan Asselijn, Pieter and Jan Frans van Bloemen, Andries and Jan Both, Karel Dujardin, Samuel van Hoogstraten, Pieter van Laer, Pieter Mulier (d 1670), Lodewijk Primo (1606–67), Jan-Baptist Weenix and Dominicus van Wijnen (b 1661) were among the group’s notable initiates. A catalogue of Bentvueghels compiled by Hoogewerff (1952) contains well over 200 entries.

”

It sounds to me like this is a series of individual portraits rather than a "group picture" as our article describes it. GabrielF (talk) 06:41, 29 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you very much! This is just what I needed. — Mr. Stradivarius ^♫ 16:37, 29 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]